The Personalist Project

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Comments (9)

Katie van Schaijik

#1, Feb 13, 2014 2:28pm

It's interesting that you post on this topic, Sam.  I've just finished reading An Interview with an Exorcist.

It taught me some things I didn't know, such as that possession or demonic infestation (of a house, say) can be caused by a curse someone else invokes—in other words, it may not be the fault of the one possessed.  He also says that it's possible for a possessed person's soul to be in a state of grace, since possession on involves the body, not the soul.

Samwise

#2, Feb 13, 2014 3:19pm

Ah, Fr. Fortea was trained by Fr Amorth!  Thanks Katie, that clarifies a few things for me, especially in regard to the Emily Rose movie. 

I will edit the post according to your thoughts from Fr. Fortea.

Katie van Schaijik

#3, Feb 14, 2014 3:24am

Now I'm reading The Rite: the Making of a Modern Exorcist.

Check this out:

According to Saint John Chrysostom, “Possessed persons can obtain a twofold benefit from their condition. In the first place they can become more holy and good; secondly, having paid the debt for their sins here on earth, they can present themselves pure before the Lord.”

Amazing, no?

I have a feeling that all of us would do well to try to understand demonic activity better. I think we're going to be seeing lots of more of it openly unleashed.

It's interesting to think about what the insights of personalism might have to teach us here. After all, demons are persons, according to Church dogma. They are selves; they have autonomy and intelligence and agency.

Samwise

#4, Feb 14, 2014 8:28am

Katie van Schaijik, Feb. 14 at 4:24am

I think we're going to be seeing lots of more of it openly unleashed.

It's interesting to think about what the insights of personalism might have to teach us here. After all, demons are persons, according to Church dogma. They are selves; they have autonomy and intelligence and agency.

 I was hesitating to make that conclusion of personhood, but thank you!  Very interesting

If an increased amount of demonic activity is near, I think the legalization of drugs is closely connected.

Katie van Schaijik

#5, Feb 14, 2014 9:26am

I'd guess even more the widespread acceptance of sexual perversion and the legalization of same sex marriage.

Katie van Schaijik

#6, Feb 15, 2014 3:09am

Sam, here's more from The Rite.

Just as surprising to Father Gary, however, were the times Father Carmine was unable to discern the cause of possession. In one such case involving a devout woman in her early thirties, she was neither a victim of the occult nor a curse. In the end he surmised that her possession must be for the “expiation of sin.”

Years ago, when The Exorcism of Emily Rose came out, a dear devout friend of mine said something similar about her. He thought she was a victim soul, suffering for the expiation of sin. That sounded nuts to me. But here it is again.

I'm learning a lot.

Samwise

#7, Feb 17, 2014 8:40am

Yeah, Emily Rose's real-life basis is Anneliese Michel.

it appears that like blindness, leprosy, and other afflictions that were once associated with sin but turned out to be only "for the glory of God" in the words of Jesus--possession too can be like that.  This is to avoid a kind of "witch-hunt" of sorts, that would accuse people of possession due to sin.  This is why priests practice the "discernment of spirits"

By and large though, I agree with you about perversion, etc. being gateways for demons.   

Overall, it's a very mysterious thing, I'm glad that the Church has some understanding of it and a "cure" for the 'sickness'.

Katie van Schaijik

#8, Feb 17, 2014 8:52am

Me too.

Samwise

#9, Feb 17, 2014 9:06am

I want to add certain video games to the list of gateways for demons.  All of the school shootings of the past 20 years have been related to extremely violent games with high-powered weapons.

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